Sunday Classics preview: Sure, you can identify the piece, but is one performance different from the others?
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(And yes, Bil, there'll be a prize
for identifying all our fiddlers)
by Ken
And don't worry if you're new to this stuff and can't identify the piece.Not only are you more than welcome here, the freshness of your ears may give you an advantage. Plus, I'm going to guarantee that you know at least one composition by this composer, which you'll hear in tomorrow night's Sunday Classics preview. As you may have guessed, the composer is the subject of Sunday's post.
To me, one of these performances captures an essential quality of the music that the others don't. In this regard there are no right or wrong answers -- feel free to share anything that strikes you about any or all of the performances. (They'll all be identified in tomorrow night's preview.)
A.
B.
C.
D.
E.
SUNDAY CLASSICS POSTS
The current list is here.
by Ken
And don't worry if you're new to this stuff and can't identify the piece.Not only are you more than welcome here, the freshness of your ears may give you an advantage. Plus, I'm going to guarantee that you know at least one composition by this composer, which you'll hear in tomorrow night's Sunday Classics preview. As you may have guessed, the composer is the subject of Sunday's post.
To me, one of these performances captures an essential quality of the music that the others don't. In this regard there are no right or wrong answers -- feel free to share anything that strikes you about any or all of the performances. (They'll all be identified in tomorrow night's preview.)
A.
B.
C.
D.
E.
SUNDAY CLASSICS POSTS
The current list is here.
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Labels: DWT Quiz, Sunday Classics
posted by KenInNY @ 9:00 PM
16 comments
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16 Comments:
We LOVES prizes!
Thanks Keni!
(don no nutn bout fiddlrz:)
You see what happens when you go offering prizes?
Ken
This is a game my father used to play with me, and the tradition continued when I attended Juilliard; I had a colleague who used to try and stump me, by playing a different famous violinist in the same piece, just as you have done. I will not give my answers here to ruin it for anyone, but I am positive that ALL the examples are of great older violinists, all born before 1930. The second example is unfortunately pitched almost a half-step high (maybe an old transfer glitch) and causes the vibrato to be considerably faster.
This is so much FUN! The newer great violinists, have distinct personalities, but it takes a lot longer to recognize, whereas the older group is more discernable, I think.
I'd love to submit my list of violinists. Where can I send it?
Right here, Bruce. We do everything out in the open.
Ken
WON'T IT RUIN THE FUN FOR SOME PEOPLE?
It doesn't worry me, Bruce, but if it worries you, you're welcome to hold off until, say, 8:59 PT. Tonight's preview post with all the performances identified will go up at 9pm PT.
Thanks for that catch about the pitch of B, by the way. As you'll see, it's not from the most reliable source. Interestingly, even speeded up, it's still by a good margin the longest of these performances.
That's also because they included the short introduction to the last movement, which was left out in the other examples.
OK! Here goes: (a list narrowing the field would be easier, as I am literally pulling out the names of 50+ "greats" in the dark)
A- Very possibly Joseph Szigeti
B- Very possibly Arthur Grumiaux (the raised pitch and sped up vibrato due to this, make it difficult to commit) It could also be Ginette Neveu
C- Zino Francescatti
D- Most definitely Jascha Heifetz
E- Probably Yehudi Menuhin
If I am incorrect in some examples, please send me a "short list" of 20 names, and I will be more likely to "hone" in on who it is.
Thanks for doing this!!!!!
Very interesting, Bruce. I don't think that ruins it for anyone else, does it? (We'd have to know how right you are, wouldn't we?)
Of course, I'm still interested in the way these folks chose to play the piece, which I confess in a number of instances still surprises me.
Thanks for joining in.
Ken
For the most part, not having the advantage of vast selections of recordings to listen to for reference, as we have today, they all developed their individual "sounds" by listening to the "greats" of their day, live in concert, and creating their own personality on the violin, building on what they could recall hearing on stage and also from fellow students (Heifetz, Milstein, Oistrakh, Seidel were all within a few years of each other in Odessa) Musically, the traditions of interpretation were handed down, and modified by each successive generation, to fit in more with the current musical climate; hence the almost total elimination by the 1960's of the slurpy portamento, replaced by more controlled tasteful expressions of violinistic musicality. Interpretations of the Mendelssohn Concerto, will always have roots in romanticism, but there is always the tendency to overplay, and although, as you quite rightly stated in the beginning, there are no right or wrong answers, some renditions will reach your heart! You never really know precisely what causes that personal "wow", and many times analysis ruins it!
I'm CHALLENGED! How about a "short" list???
All true, Bruce, but at some point you're no longer expressing a tradition of performance, you're giving your own performance. As you'll see in tonight's post, I'm somewhere between disappointed and shocked by the way most violinists have heard this movement (I could have added 30 other performances), to the extent of what seems to me fundamentally missing the point of the music.
Even the performance in this group which I like best is hardly my ideal. In semi-compensation, though, in the course of playing with these sound files I found myself rather grudgingly coming around somewhat on one of the others.
Ken
LOL, Hi Ken,
it's Mimi (Howie's pal)...I hadda sic Bruce on you for this one (people don't realize, but Bruce and I went to Juilliard together and he was considered one of the best violinists, having once been a concert violinist and the CONCERTMASTER/first violinist of the Hollywood Bowl Orchestra, so maybe he knows a few things?? heh heh) So Ken, you have quite an esteemed visitor to your site!!
Hmmm...I'm inclined to say that
A Stern (later in his career?)
B Heifetz
But I'm in agreement that these are older recordings, altho C sounds a bit newer.
C Henryk Szeryng
D Yehudi Menuhin
E Pinchas Zucherman
?????????????
I will admit to some baldfaced guessing here so don't laugh Bruce/Ken!!
Meanwhile, they are all wonderful renditions. The first one sticks out because whoever it is is so amazingly careful about placing his fingers at exactly the right place (which is why i think it was a violinist who was recording later in his life). And he sure takes his time. When I first started the clip, I was thinking, wow, this is the slowest version I've ever heard.
Hi, Mimi --
Thanks for joining in!
This is all interesting, and fluid -- as I noted above, I've tipped from a sad dismissal to a grudging "well, maybe" on one of these performances in just the last 24 hours!
I don't want to say more for now. This is the one place in the world where I don't have to worry about being able to have my say!
Ken
General note: I should have noted this earlier, but what Bruce and Mimi are surmising, or on their way to surmising, is correct: These are ALL performances by older generations of violinists. (I wouldn't expect to find what I'm looking for from the younger violinists. What surprised me is how little I got from the older ones. No wonder it took me so long to have my epiphany about this movement.)
And in recognition of Bruce's generational point, I've added birth and death dates to the identifications in the 9pm PT post.
Oops, well, I've said it -- yes, none of our fiddlers are still with us.
Ken
well...I will say that of the current generation of fiddle players, that Joshua Bell has yet to disappointment me!! (I would love to flog that Washington reporter who made Joshua play in a subway tho!)
All is revealed now, more or less. And thanks to our players.
Bruce, if you'll contact me at kenfromdwt@aol.com, we can see what I can offer you by way of a prize.
Ken
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